| rabb1t | » #386413 Saturday June 27, 2009 at 13:17 | |
Member |
I'm considering using a DPS spec for one of my builds, but I'm curious what kind of numbers I should have before claiming I'm "DPS". What kind of DPS figures should a raid level Death Knight target? I've seen reference by some around 2.5k, and I know that with my tanking gear the DPS spec I'm looking at did around 1.5k (about +50-75% the DPS average of the tanking specs I use), but I'm curious if anyone has any 'solid' figures on it. Don't raid level Rogues/Hunters/Mages and such hit around 2.5-5k on the average, with 10k at the super uber gear levels? --
 rabb1t.com - pc gaming hardware tech talk for everyone “Hey, can I get a buff in case we go back to pwning their doods? kthx.” - Belkar Bitterleaf, The Order of the Stick |
|
| Todyn | » #386415 Saturday June 27, 2009 at 13:20 | |
Member |
depends on which raids and how geared is your dk. I would say a full naxx 25 geared DK, can expect anywhere from 4.5k to 6k in Ulduar. Entry into naxx 25, i would expect at least 2k from a dps. --
 |
|
| Brennith | » #386444 Saturday June 27, 2009 at 16:08 | |
Prot 4 life. Rets R dumb. |
You might want to ask in the Death Knight forums.
--
I do art? http://zandstra.deviantart.com/ ----------------------- quote: Originally posted by Alinna: It turns out that the light isn't a primal power, it's just what the Naaru excrete. |
|
| Arkhain | » #386477 Saturday June 27, 2009 at 17:17 | |
ne cede malis |
Clearly, this is proof that DKs are the only class that should be doing DPS.
--
          |
|
| rabb1t | » #386541 Saturday June 27, 2009 at 22:01 | |
|
Member |
quote: Originally posted by Brennith: You might want to ask in the Death Knight forums. Or I may not since I'm asking for comparisons of other classes and want comparative numbers to the true DPS classes before I consider if I want to try claiming myself as one (even a 'plate DPS'). =p --
rabb1t.com - pc gaming hardware tech talk for everyone “Hey, can I get a buff in case we go back to pwning their doods? kthx.” - Belkar Bitterleaf, The Order of the Stick |
|
| Mantas | » #388171 Friday July 3, 2009 at 00:42 | |
Member |
Its been awhile since i was looking at entry level stuff, and there have been some changes, but ill try and toss some numbers at you. When you ask for raid level, it really depends what tier, as there is a leap from heroics gearnaxx10, to naxx25/ulduar10, then ulduar 25. For starting out in heroics blue/epics, spec unholy imo, it makes up a bit for lacking gear. Frost seems weak for most raid bosses, and blood is great but you need the gear for it. I'm thinking you should be able to pull 2.5k to 3k dps in 5mans, a bit more in raids. 2k dps in raids seems really fail, but like i said..been awhile. The only real benchmark for single target dps is patchwerk 25. Starter level should aim to break 4k dps in a 3-4 minute kill. Naxx 25 geared should aim to break 5k, ulduar25 level people should break 6k, generally speaking. Keep in mind, your raids overall dps and kill time contribute allot to your dps, the longer the kill, the lower your dps will be. Also, nobody gets near 10k dps, unless its a gimmick fight like thaddius, XT, or hodir, with massive dps boosts. Ulduar dps usualy averages 4.5-6.5k depending on class and fight. DK's are usualy near rogues, slightly less on pure single target, slightly more if you can AE alot. --
 |
|
| Mantas edited this message on Friday July 3, 2009 at 04:04 | ||
| Mithis | » #389151 Tuesday July 7, 2009 at 17:16 | |
Member |
I'm averaging around 3k DPS on raids with Blood spec. Some Unholy spec DKs are averaging 4k DPS, but I'm admittedly short on ArP still, and I much prefer Blood to Unholy.
--
 |
|
| rabb1t | » #389158 Tuesday July 7, 2009 at 17:40 | |
|
Member |
I was talking with a Warrior about it the other day (plate DPS - why this got bounced specifically to DK is beyond me) and he said he'll hit 4.5k on a good round. He's in Uldar level gear though, which is higher than my stuffs. It seems pretty crazy that a plate DPS can match a Rogue. I guess it's all about the outgoing damage and since we can use a lot of the same stuff it makes sense. Though I'd think that the Rogue talents would be higher + damage. I guess too those plate DPSers who can match them won't be 'last man standing' when things go bad. (I'm pretty much always last standing when I'm tanking in blood and things go badly. =D ) I've seen a lot who are DPS going for Unholy, though it seems odd since it looks like a lot of the abilities just modify your auto-attack damage. I'd think Blood with it's +x damage and +Crits would be higher total damage. I did do double my DPS when I tested a DPS build though compared to my tanking build when I split Blood/Unholy. (Necrosis, Blood-Caked Blade, Corpse Explosion.) I'll probably just wind up staying dual tank spec. Thought the thought of doing DPS is like wheeee (especially with the nice "kersplorsh!" the Corpse Explosion makes) it's really kind of against my nature to just sit back and do damage and not care at all about where the critter is going or who it's targeting. I likes to protect peeps, heh. I am still very torn about Dancing Rune Weapon though (over something like splitting into Unholy for Corpse Explosion to get an AE to compensate for Blood's lack of AE.) It's really great vs. bosses, but a lot of times I feel CE would be a lot more helpful overall in a raid. It's like if you get that perfect setup with Hysteria and then can do things like quad to six shot Heart Strike with DRW it's great, but other times it's like you hit it then get tossed out of range or stunned and it's a complete waste - just sits there doing nothing. At this point I'm seeing exactly what 3.2 will change for both my tank specs and go from there. I figure nothing would stop me from going tank spec in DPS gear to do some DPS when it's needed heh. --
rabb1t.com - pc gaming hardware tech talk for everyone “Hey, can I get a buff in case we go back to pwning their doods? kthx.” - Belkar Bitterleaf, The Order of the Stick |
|
| rabb1t | » #389160 Tuesday July 7, 2009 at 17:48 | |
|
Member |
quote: Originally posted by Mithis: I'm averaging around 3k DPS on raids with Blood spec. Peeping said spec... If you are pure DPS wouldn't it be better to remove Toughness, Spell Deflection, and Blood Worms and move the points to Hysteria, Necrosis, Blood-Caked Blade, and Corpse Explosion? I'd think a DPSer who isn't getting hit wouldn't need the extra armor or that much healing since Blood presence and maxed Rune Tap would take care of most of your healing needs. Though, pure DPS tend to fall pretty quickly if they get hit, even in plate, heh. Not saying how to do your build, just seems curious compared to a pure DPS build. =) The build I've tried for DPS can be found here (FYI to anyone curious if I didn't link it before.) --
rabb1t.com - pc gaming hardware tech talk for everyone “Hey, can I get a buff in case we go back to pwning their doods? kthx.” - Belkar Bitterleaf, The Order of the Stick |
|
| Arkhain | » #389165 Tuesday July 7, 2009 at 18:28 | |
|
ne cede malis |
On the note about blood DPS specs, Epidemic is a handy talent since it'll let you make better use of your rune conversions. 15 seconds won't last you an entire double rune bar cycle, but 21 will.
--
|
|
| Kinzy | » #389167 Tuesday July 7, 2009 at 19:11 | |
Member |
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#jfVMVh0Icfkf0stZfMbhxc Top DPS Blood spec, not imo, by the numbers. Tested, calculated and true. |
|
| Kinzy | » #389168 Tuesday July 7, 2009 at 19:14 | |
|
Member |
The meat of your single target rotation will be IT-PS-HS-HS-DS -DUMP- DS-HS-HS-HS-HS -Dump- In the first dump phase of your first rotation you should raise your ghoul in general, there is a nice little free GCD there for you. Like this: IT-PS-HS-HS-DS-Raise Ghoul-DC-DS-HS-HS-HS-HS -Dump- If you are a creature of habit, or just want to make your life easiest, you can stick with this rotation, and do just fine. At the beginning of fights you can switch your first rotation around slightly, as follows: Leading with Death Strike will proc Abomination's Might right off the bat, getting it up before making any other attacks. Making your initial rotation: DS-IT-PS-HS-HS--Raise Ghoul-DC-HS-HS-DS-HS-HS -Dump- then return to: IT-PS-HS-HS-DS-Raise Ghoul-DC-DS-HS-HS-HS-HS -Dump- Taken from the EJ forums. My Belf DK did 2.5k Dummy DPS unbuffed on a 5 minute parse in quest gear as soon as she hit 80 |
|
| Kinzy | » #389169 Tuesday July 7, 2009 at 19:17 | |
|
Member |
Oh, and the lazy macro #showtooltip /targetnearestenemy /castsequence reset=target/dead Icy Touch, Plague Strike, Heart Strike, Heart Strike, Death Strike, Death Strike, Heart Strike, Heart Strike, Heart Strike, Heart Strike |
|
| rabb1t | » #389177 Tuesday July 7, 2009 at 20:31 | |
|
Member |
quote: Originally posted by Arkhain: On the note about blood DPS specs, Epidemic is a handy talent since it'll let you make better use of your rune conversions. I'm experimenting with that now (and did a little before), as I noticed the disease pulses do some pretty huge damage. (Seems to be about 50% of the initial non-critical hit of things like Icy Touch or Death Coil. Which makes me wonder if boosting Icy Touch damage is worth it compared to something like Epidemic. Of course the big boost for that for tanks is the debuff, not the damage.) I've never been one to watch/analize damage numbers, but it seems like using Epidemic + Pestilence could potentially do more AE DPS than things like spamming Blood Boil. Pretty close to the one I've tried save for Epidemic and Blood Worms. - - - I wonder though with Epidemic if it is worth it for just one target. It really seems to only be necessary/useful if you are hitting Pestilence to spread the disease out. With a single target it seems like the natural rotations don't really run out even with the unbuffed durations. (I basically do IT - PS - DS - HS - HS - rune dump. Every few cycles you can do quad HS due to the death runes there at the end.) IMO diseases should be removed from the base attacks alltogether. I really don't see how it ties in to the lore of DK. Maybe my memory is off, but I don't ever recall Arthas using disease (pre or post transformation.) It would 'feel' more right if they were their own talents in the first tier. Then maybe you could boost them in rank in later tiers to do more damage or higher duration or whatever. Maybe it's just me, but I think blood should be all about (straight up) damage and regeneration. I don't see how disease fits in to it. --
rabb1t.com - pc gaming hardware tech talk for everyone “Hey, can I get a buff in case we go back to pwning their doods? kthx.” - Belkar Bitterleaf, The Order of the Stick |
|
| Arkhain | » #389189 Tuesday July 7, 2009 at 21:39 | |
|
ne cede malis |
Epidemic is necessary for Blood. Without it, you have to apply IT+PS every single rune set, or run without diseases in your 4xHS spam section. Both of these ruin your DPS. With it, you only have to apply diseases once per two rune sets -- effectively doubling your disease durations. It's not a choice between Pestilence and Blood Boil on AOE pulls. You use both. Pest your diseases first, then Blood Boil spam as your blood runes come up. --
|
|
